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02-03-2021 13:43

Castillo Joseba Castillo Joseba

Recolectada en zona de pinos y eucaliptos,  con a

02-03-2021 21:29

Riet van Oosten Riet van Oosten

Hello,Found today (02-03-2021) on Typha spec.Is Ar

02-03-2021 16:01

Garcia Susana

Hola, He encontrado estos peritecios y me gustar

02-03-2021 14:52

Castillo Joseba Castillo Joseba

Me mandan el material seco de Galicia,  recolecta

25-02-2021 17:28

Pierre-Arthur Moreau Pierre-Arthur Moreau

Bonjour à tous,Un étudiant en Master 2 du CEFE d

01-03-2021 17:01

Menno Boomsluiter

I was wondering, if any, what the status of Xylari

28-02-2021 20:18

Stefan Blaser

Hello everybody, I am not getting on with the fol

01-03-2021 18:33

Blasco Rafael Blasco Rafael

Hola, He encontrado estas muestras sobre Juglans

01-03-2021 17:21

Enrique Rubio Enrique Rubio

Hi againI have found small, rounded, gregarious, n

01-03-2021 11:28

Mirek Gryc

Hello everyone.The only thing I can say about it i

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Helvella atra?
Lepista Zacarias, 23-02-2021 19:26
Dear all,

Again with a specimen of Helvella, which I believe as much in common with Helvella atra, mainly the stem. The cap however is a bit distinct from what I'm used to observe, not only because of the three saddles, but also because of the colour and texture. Is there any other species with these features?

Thanks in advance,
zaca
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Lepista Zacarias, 23-02-2021 19:35
Re : Helvella atra?
I forgot to add the dimensions of the spores, what I do now:
(17.9) 18.6 - 21.07 (21.1) × (11.1) 11.2 - 13.6 (13.7) µm
Q = (1.5) 1.52 - 1.7 ; N = 20
Me = 19.8 × 12.3 µm ; Qe = 1.6
Marek Capoun, 24-02-2021 09:49
Marek Capoun
Re : Helvella atra?
Hello, Zaca,
try any key to this genus, for example: https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC5832953/
Regards,
Marek
Lepista Zacarias, 24-02-2021 13:00
Re : Helvella atra?
Dear Marek,
thanks for your suggestion and link.

However, I have a problem while trying to appy the key, as follows:
I think that is easy to reach the point 54 of the key; For clearliness I repeat the steps below. After that there are only a few taxa remaining:
H. bicolor, H. fistulosa, H. levis, H. monachella,
none of which can be selected as direct application of the key, in my opinion. The one which "seems" closer (looking at photos available in the internet) is H. monachella, but the spores of are much bigger than those of my specimen. So, what to do?

Can anyone help?
Thanks, zaca


Evolution in the key:
1. Apothecium with a ± prominent distinct stipe. . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . 2
2. Stipe terete, even, internally solid or hollow, occasionally with
grooves at base and/or apex, tissues well differentiated. . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . 30
30. Apothecium convex, bi- to trilobate saddle-shaped, or irregularly lobed. . . .  43
43. Cap saddle-shaped or irregularly lobed with a ± deflexed margin. . . . . . . . . 50
50. Receptacle surface glabrous. . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . 54

Marek Capoun, 26-02-2021 07:57
Marek Capoun
Re : Helvella atra?
I'm sorry, I've never seen any of the species you named. But I have experienced that H. atra, according to various sources, can have a stipe only with a shallow dent or blunt ribs. That's all I can say about it. Regards, Marek.
Lepista Zacarias, 27-02-2021 23:24
Re : Helvella atra?
Thanks, Marek, for your collaboration.
Regards,
zaca
Mirek Gryc, 28-02-2021 09:19
Re : Helvella atra?
Hi Zaca
I think Marek is right and it could be an ascomata of a slightly unusual H. atra. Often, such ones grow together with more typical ones ... below I present one of my collections.
greetings
Mirek
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Lepista Zacarias, 28-02-2021 11:43
Re : Helvella atra?
Yeah, thanks. Mirek,
for giving me your opinion.
Looking back to the starting point, from the title of the topic, that was my understanding, but then I decided to question to get more confidence and this now happen.
Regards from Portugal,
zaca
Peter Püwert, 28-02-2021 12:15
Peter Püwert
Re : Helvella atra?
Hi all,

100% we could not decide. Here our collections of H.atra, the same mycelium.

Regards Peter.
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Lepista Zacarias, 28-02-2021 12:38
Re : Helvella atra?
Thanks, Peter,
for increasing the percentage level of confidence. That's always nice to hearing from you and seeing some of your inexhaustible stock of beautiful photos.
Kind regards,
zaca

P.S.: Maybe, I became confused by the trilobed cap.
Mirek Gryc, 28-02-2021 17:45
Re : Helvella atra?
A beautiful but difficult topic, the more so as not all collections correspond to the descriptions of a given genre.
Quote:
"Apothecia stipitate-capitate, saddle-shaped or irregularly lobed,
1–4 cm broad, 3–12 cm high, cap margin adnate and attached
to stipe at 3–4 points; hymenium and stipe blackish with a dark
violet brown tinge (10-12F-H7-8), even or wrinkled; receptacle
surface greyish brown to black, smooth, with inconspicuous
ribs on outer surface; stipe 0.5–2.5 cm broad, naked, with 4–7
sharp-edged, partly double-edged ribs, attached at 3–4 points
to the reflexed apothecial margin greyish brown to black, paler
towards base, ribs prominent, sharp, partly anastomosing and
double-edged, with 'holes' (lacunae) between ribs, stipe chambered
inside. "

In the Peter collection, the edges of the hat do not touch the stem. I also often meet such collections. Perhaps their shape depends largely on the habitat?

Peter, and your Helvella won't be H. pezizoides?

Mirek