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Lasiosphaeria lanuginosa?
Hermine Lotz-Winter,
30-09-2009 21:54
il y a deux semaines j'ai trouvé une Lasiosphaeria (comme je crois...) avec tomentum jaune-verdatre, les ascomata noirs et les plus vieux avec seulement peu de tomentum. Les perithecies etaient sur le surface de bois de feuillus sans ecorce (Alnus?) près d'un rivage dans un lieu ombragé sur terre sablé fangeuse. Les perithecies avaient un contenu jaune d'or. Les spores mesuraient 40 - 50 x 5 µm, sans septum avec deux gouttes très grandes. Les immatures avaient des appendages hyalines. Encore dans les asques (140 x 12) il developpaient une tete brune foncee assez grosse, quelques fois avec septum.
Ca pourrait etre Lasiosphaeria lanuginosa?
Merci pour votre opinion!
Hermine
Alain GARDIENNET,
30-09-2009 21:59
Re:Lasiosphaeria lanuginosa?
Bonjour Hermine,
Je crois qu'il faudrait aller chercher vers le genre Cercophora. Je ne suis pas un spécialiste de celui-ci malheureusement.
Alain
Je crois qu'il faudrait aller chercher vers le genre Cercophora. Je ne suis pas un spécialiste de celui-ci malheureusement.
Alain
Hermine Lotz-Winter,
30-09-2009 22:09
Re:Lasiosphaeria lanuginosa?
Merci Alain,
il ya'avait deux points, qui m'ont fait des problemes: le tomentum resemblait un peu a les poils du genre Cercophora, et autour de l'ostiole je crois d'avoir vu des poils. Huhndorf et Miller decrivent l'apex de l'ascoma comme "glabrous" .....
Peut-etre il y a des autres opinions?
Hermine
il ya'avait deux points, qui m'ont fait des problemes: le tomentum resemblait un peu a les poils du genre Cercophora, et autour de l'ostiole je crois d'avoir vu des poils. Huhndorf et Miller decrivent l'apex de l'ascoma comme "glabrous" .....
Peut-etre il y a des autres opinions?
Hermine
Jacques Fournier,
30-09-2009 22:39
Re:Lasiosphaeria lanuginosa?
Bonsoir Hermine,
ça ne ressemble pas trop à lanuginosa dont le tomentum n'est pas jaune. Je pense plutôt à une espèce aquatique qui se reconnaît facilement à ce que les appendices des spores sont très fragiles et se cassent en laissant un morceau tronqué de 2-3 µm.
Amitiés,
Jacques
ça ne ressemble pas trop à lanuginosa dont le tomentum n'est pas jaune. Je pense plutôt à une espèce aquatique qui se reconnaît facilement à ce que les appendices des spores sont très fragiles et se cassent en laissant un morceau tronqué de 2-3 µm.
Amitiés,
Jacques
Andrew N. Miller,
30-09-2009 23:58
Re:Lasiosphaeria lanuginosa?
This lies somewhere between Cercophora sparsa with smaller spores and Cercophora sulphurella with larger spores. It is a very nice find!
Andy
Andy
Hermine Lotz-Winter,
01-10-2009 08:19
Re:Lasiosphaeria lanuginosa?
Thank you Jacques and Andrew,
I will make a better description and better pictures. Jacques, it was really obvious, that the appendages of the spores were very fragile, but I didn't know, that this was a feature leading to Cercospora (not much experience with this genus...).
Have a nice day both of you
Hermine
I will make a better description and better pictures. Jacques, it was really obvious, that the appendages of the spores were very fragile, but I didn't know, that this was a feature leading to Cercospora (not much experience with this genus...).
Have a nice day both of you
Hermine
Alain GARDIENNET,
01-10-2009 10:14
Re:Lasiosphaeria lanuginosa?
Andrew, when you say "between", you suppose it could be another species, a new species in Cercophora ? (Hermine, you've made a lapsus Cercophora and no Cercospora)
I'm interesting because I've also made (last tuesday, in freshwater) the same recolt than Jacques, who has described this recolt well known for him.
Alain
I'm interesting because I've also made (last tuesday, in freshwater) the same recolt than Jacques, who has described this recolt well known for him.
Alain
Hermine Lotz-Winter,
01-10-2009 10:46
Re:Lasiosphaeria lanuginosa?
Thank you, Alain,
I really prefer Cercophora to Cercospora :-) I'm interested, too, because a friend of mine has found a Cercophora in freshwater, which seems to be an undescribed species, but mentioned in the paper of Lundqvist. I will try to get his data, perhaps we can compare the collections.
Hermine
I really prefer Cercophora to Cercospora :-) I'm interested, too, because a friend of mine has found a Cercophora in freshwater, which seems to be an undescribed species, but mentioned in the paper of Lundqvist. I will try to get his data, perhaps we can compare the collections.
Hermine
Andrew N. Miller,
01-10-2009 16:30
Re:Lasiosphaeria lanuginosa?
Alain, yes it is possible that this could be a new species of Cercophora, but this group (species complex) is a real mess and needs a thorough study to sort it out. Several names are involved, which may or may not represent "real" species:
C. sulphurella
C. sparsa
C. citrina (on dung)
Lasiospheria lutea
Jacques has a few collections of a possible new species as well.
There are at least 20 names in Lasiosphaeria and Cercophora that possess ascomata with white or yellowish hairs or tomentum. The distinction between a tightly compressed tomentum and hairs that stick out is also not clear and is more of a gradation from one to the other.
Andy
C. sulphurella
C. sparsa
C. citrina (on dung)
Lasiospheria lutea
Jacques has a few collections of a possible new species as well.
There are at least 20 names in Lasiosphaeria and Cercophora that possess ascomata with white or yellowish hairs or tomentum. The distinction between a tightly compressed tomentum and hairs that stick out is also not clear and is more of a gradation from one to the other.
Andy
Jacques Fournier,
01-10-2009 16:50
Re:Lasiosphaeria lanuginosa?
Of course I agree with Andy that things are much complicated, with generic and specific boundaries that are still ill-defined. More sampling from different regions, fresh material available for culture and hard lab work might be able to elucidate some pending questions. But probably also to pose further problems, as usual !
People attending Ascofrance should be very helpful with their collections and observations.
Jacques
People attending Ascofrance should be very helpful with their collections and observations.
Jacques
Andrew N. Miller,
01-10-2009 16:56
Re:Lasiosphaeria lanuginosa?
Jacques, I agree.
AscoFrance is a GREAT resource and a real value to the ascomycete community!
Thanks Christian!
Andy
AscoFrance is a GREAT resource and a real value to the ascomycete community!
Thanks Christian!
Andy